Does it 'work'?

Saoirse · **Posted:** Tue 21 Aug 2012 12:39 pm

Bríd Mhór wrote:

Lughaidh wrote:

Most of the time, "síos" "suas" etc have a motion meaning (downwards, upwards) in Irish, but in English, "down" and "up" etc very often have no motion meaning at all (when something is broken down, tell me why it goes "down"? :darklaugh:

-- it's the kind of things that non-native-English-speakers like me immediately notice because they are very strange, we don't see the link between being broken and going down, except maybe if the object falls on the floor :mrgreen:

)

A good way to remember it :yes:

A very good way! :yes:

Lughaidh · **Joined:** Thu 15 Sep 2011 12:06 pm **Posts:** 2435

Quote:

Like: Dúisigh suas.
I haven't heard éist suas (listen up) yet, but it's only a matter of time!

I don't even understand what éist suas means :darklaugh:

Quote:

But we do say suigh síos and seas suas - was this always the case, I wonder, as síos and suas are redundant here really.

yeah ; I always heard "suigh síos", but I know you can say "seas" in Ulster, without "suas", becaus "seas" by itself already means stand up.

Quote:

In English it is different as you can say sit down, sit up, stand up, stand down - in quite different contexts.

wow, I didn't know you could say sit up and stand down :-) Do you use them when you are upside down (eg. in a spaceship)? :darklaugh:

Saoirse · **Posted:** Tue 21 Aug 2012 2:28 pm

Lughaidh wrote:

Quote:Like: Dúisigh suas.I haven't heard éist suas (listen up) yet, but it's only a matter of time!I don't even understand what éist suas means

'Listen up' really just means 'listen' or 'listen carefully'.

Lughaidh wrote:

Quote:In English it is different as you can say sit down, sit up, stand up, stand down - in quite different contexts.wow, I didn't know you could say sit up and stand down :-) Do you use them when you are upside down (eg. in a spaceship)?

'Sit up' means 'sit up straight', perhaps to students in a classroom.

'Stand down' might be said to someone in a military capacity to mean that they should not proceed with their course of action.

Idioms have to be one of the hardest parts of any language. :pages:

Lughaidh · **Joined:** Thu 15 Sep 2011 12:06 pm **Posts:** 2435

Well, have to learn them by heart without trying to understand why they are like that: only native speakers find them self-evident :mrgreen:

Go rabh maith agad ar son do mhíniúchán...

Breandán · **Posted:** Tue 21 Aug 2012 3:11 pm

Irish does use suas for a sense of completion without any actual motion being involved. (Even Japanese uses its word for "up" in a similar sense of completion, 出来上がる, etc.)

Ceangail suas é "Tie it up"
gléasta suas "dressed up"
Glan suas an teach "Clean up the house"

It pays to be wary of the use of suas and síos but not all of it is Béarlachas. Some expressions that have been around for at least a hundred years:

cur suas le "to tolerate"
ag cur suas ar "preventing"
fásta suas "grown up"
tá sé ag spalpadh suas "the weather is clearing up (after rain)"
tá na páistidhe ag éirghe suas agat "your children are advancing in size and age, are coming to maturity"
ag breith suas air "gripping him"
tóg suas díom "let go thy hold of me, let me go"
tá sé ag glanadh suas "the weather (or the day) is clearing"
cur suas "to promote; also to incite"
tabhairt suas "education; also surrender (mil. term)" tá t. suas mór air"he is highly educated"
bíodh do shúil suas "keep up your expectation, you may still expect it from me (S. W. Cork)"
gur líon sé suas a théibe "till he filled up his paunch"
do thiormuigh an lá suas "the day became dry, the rain ceased (in M., Con. and U. pron. triomuighim)"

It can be seen that suas has this usage, síos not.

Lughaidh · **Joined:** Thu 15 Sep 2011 12:06 pm **Posts:** 2435

Yeah, sometimes "suas" expressed a "figurated" (?) upwards motion

(eg. fás suas or líon suas)

Quote:

tá na páistidhe ag éirghe suas agat

I often heard "ag éirí aníos" in this meaning from Donegal speakers

Quote:

Irish does use suas for a sense of completion without any actual motion being involved. (Even Japanese uses its word for "up" in a similar sense of completion, 出来上がる, etc.)

Ceangail suas é "Tie it up"
gléasta suas "dressed up"
Glan suas an teach "Clean up the house"

aren't those translated from English? Hard to say.

Gumbi · **Joined:** Tue 06 Sep 2011 8:09 pm **Posts:** 943

You would think, but a lot of them actually are in the dictionaries and have been around for quite a while.

Scooby · **Joined:** Tue 06 Sep 2011 7:18 pm **Posts:** 576

Breandán wrote:

tá sé ag spalpadh suas "the weather is clearing up (after rain)"

That one surprises me. I know Tá an ghrian ag spalpadh (blazing / bursting forth).

spalpach (triomaigh) = a drought according to FGB.

The basic meaning of the verb spalp is to burst forth or pour.

Lughaidh · **Joined:** Thu 15 Sep 2011 12:06 pm **Posts:** 2435

Yeah but when it's raining you say "tá sé ag spalpadh anuas", so there it's the opposite...

Breandán · **Posted:** Wed 22 Aug 2012 10:03 am

Lughaidh wrote:

Quote:

tá na páistidhe ag éirghe suas agat

I often heard "ag éirí aníos" in this meaning from Donegal speakers

Yeah, aníos makes more sense to me, too, at least while they are little, but then often children grow taller than their parents and suas would start to make sense then, too.

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